MR. FORDE & HIS CAREER

What attracted you to oceanography as a career and how did you get your start in the field?

My father and other science teachers I had in middle school and high school helped to motivate and interest me in science. In high school, I had a class named Environmental Oceanography, and I was also intrigued every time I watched a television show called, "The Undersea world of Jacques Cousteau". I learned to swim when I was 4 or 5 yeas old and enjoyed being near the ocean. Columbia University recruited me and as it turned out, they had one of the best oceanography programs in the world.

You've worked for NOAA your entire career. Tell us about the positions you've held and how your career has unfolded.

I was working as a cataloguer in the Florida International University library in the summer of 1973, when someone told me about the new NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration) labs on Virginia Key, Florida (near Miami). I typed my resume and came to interview for a job. I was told that they had no openings, but the Director of the Marine Geology and Geophysics lab saw that I was a student at Columbia University, and that I had good grades, and he had the personnel department create a special student position for me. I worked in the lab during summers and vacations and won a fellowship from NOAA to go to graduate school in 1974.

Basically, my career progression has been from "lab assistant" to "lab technician" to "graduate scientist" to "oceanographer" to "research oceanographer". I have worked in several different disciplines since the Marine Geology and Geophysics laboratory ceased to exist in about 1984.

You've also been very involved in public education and community service. Tell us about this aspect of your career and why you've made it a focus.

I am very committed to outreach and science education. I authored "Science Corner", a science education article with experiments for Ebony Jr., a nationally distributed children's magazine, for two years; I volunteer 200-500 hours per year to local school and educational activities; and I have personally spoken to more than 18,000 South Florida school children through scientific and career day presentations.

My father taught me that the best way to make sure that my children were in quality school and community programs was to get involved myself, and that I had a responsibility to give something back to my community. I am hopefully teaching my sons the importance of being involved in the community. I also strongly encourage science teachers and others to become members of the National Science Teacher Association (NSTA) and other groups that promote teacher training in general and science education.

Tell us about some of the awards and recognition that you've received in the field.

My most notable awards and honors include:

• NOAA Research Employee of the Year (2001)
• Featured in exhibit at the Great Explorations Display at Staten Island Children's Museum (2001-2006 )
• Featured in exhibit at the Syracuse Museum of Science and Technology (2000)
• ERL EEO Employee of the Year (1986)
• Finalist for Federal Employee of the Year (1985)
• Numerous awards and honors from local schools and the local school board

I was also a Shell-sponsored seminar speaker at NSTA's national convention, March 2003 in Philadelphia.

What do you consider to be your greatest accomplishment of your career? How about the greatest setback?

History will probably say that my greatest accomplishment of my career so far was that I was the first African American oceanographer to participate in submersible dives aboard research submersibles. Personally, I believe that my greatest accomplishment was the significant advancement of knowledge on the origin and evolution of East Coast United States Submarine Canyons. Please see:

• 1981 Forde, E.B. Evolution of Veatch, Washington, and Norfolk Submarine Canyons: Inferences from strata and morphology. Marine Geology, v. 39, p.197-214.

• 1981 Forde, E.B., D.J. Stanley, W.B. Sawyer, and K.J. Slagle. Sediment transport in Washington and Norfolk Submarine Canyons. Applied Ocean Research, v. 3, no. 2, p. 59-62.

Perhaps the greatest actual accomplishment that I have made was that I discovered massive sediment slumping (similar to underwater landslides) during a research cruise that led to the Department of the Interior removing drilling rights from oil companies for billions of dollars of offshore drilling sites (offshore of Cape May, NJ). As it turned out, I did not receive the credit for this discovery, as I should have. As a very young scientist, this caused me to lose some of my trust in my fellow scientists and made me more of a scientific loner than I should have been at that stage of my career. This was perhaps also my greatest professional setback.

What are your professional goals at this stage of your career?

I would really like to get back into the field of Marine Geology and Geophysics. That is the area that I have the most formal training in, and that I am most comfortable in. I am involved in a hurricane research project now, and I hope to make worthwhile contributions to our understanding of the way Atlantic hurricane activity is affected by multi-decadal changes in the ocean temperature, especially as this relates to major hurricanes.

THE ACTUAL WORK

What exactly do oceanographers do?

Oceanographers study the oceans. Their work can be physical, biological, geological, climate-related or any of a number of other sub-disciplines.

What are your key responsibilities as a Research Oceanographer for NOAA's Atlantic Oceanographic and Meteorological Laboratory?

I am currently involved in research which utilizes satellite sensors to identify oceanic weather systems favorable for hurricane development and long-term climate change effects on hurricane development. I am also involved in research projects that study how satellite-derived Latent Heat Flux fluctuations may signal long and short term climate changes, such as El Nino.

You were the first African-American oceanographer to participate in submersible dives aboard research submersibles. Tell us about what you accomplished on these dives, personally and professionally.

We made exciting in-roads to the understanding of the development, morphology, and present-day evolution of submarine canyons. We also discovered some previously uncatalogued anemones and a few other small deep sea creatures.

How do oceanographers use computers? Are there specialty software programs for the work you do? If so, what are they and what do they do?

We use computers for virtually every minute we work. They are a vital part of our ability to rapidly and accurately process and interpret large quantities of data. I can do no in 2 minutes with a computer now what it took me 6 or 7 weeks to accomplish when I first started working for NOAA in 1973. We take scientific programs and adapt them or have programmers write specific programs to help us reach our research goals.

Is it difficult to keep up with advancing technology in the field? How do you do it?

I am constantly reading scientific journals, talking to others in the field and attending seminars and workshops. Keeping abreast of current research is sort of like being on a treadmill, but it is necessary since your work is only valuable if it has not been done before.

How can the reality of a career in oceanography differ from typical expectations?

A good scientist must be diligent, persistent, enjoy solving mysteries and patient enough to use the scientific method until they find the truth. I thought I would come to work everyday with my brief case in one hand and my scuba gear in the other. I had no idea that research projects would require writing to get funded, years to complete, and months to write and get published.

EDUCATION INFORMATION & ADVICE

Tell us about your formal education. What did you like and dislike about your own oceanography-related studies?

I received my bachelor's degree in Geology from Columbia University in 1974 and my bachelor's degree in Marine Geology and Geophysics from Columbia University (New York City) in 1976. I did not like large science classes where there was no opportunity to have personal interaction with the professors. My freshman Chemistry class had 150 kids in it, and it was more like a math class than Chemistry. I really did not enjoy that.

I was at Columbia at a very exciting time for proving the theories of continental drift and seafloor spreading. Some of my professors were key researchers in proving the theory of sea floor spreading. One of my favorite professors, Dr. Walter Alvarez and his research team were the first to propose that an asteroid hit the earth, throwing up a dust layer that encircled the earth and lead to the extinction of the dinosaurs. Today, many scientists accept the 180-mile crater as the impact site of the asteroid, and many scientists also believe that this asteroid caused the extinction of the dinosaurs. Dr. John Sanders is the professor who first got me interested in Geology and he was a scientific mentor for me for many years during my early career. When you go to a top notch University like Columbia, you will have teachers and professors who are fine human beings and world experts in their respective fields.

Your degrees are in geology and marine geology. What other kinds of degrees can lead to a career in oceanography? Do you think that this is a better educational course than pursuing a degree in oceanography?

I originally wanted to be a Marine Biologist. I changed my major to Geology because there were very few jobs available in oceanography for a person with a degree in biology in the 1970s. People who want to be oceanographers can also study Physics, Biology and Environmental Science. If you would like to get hired, I suggest that you find out what oceanographic fields are hiring before rushing off to study underwater basket weaving.

How important is it to have a graduate degree in the field?

If you want to have any chance for your career to advance and to get to conduct the types of research that are important to you, an advanced degree is a must. I would strongly suggest that anyone getting started in the field should not stop short of a PhD.

What factors should prospective oceanography students consider when choosing a program?

Get a diverse undergraduate science background. Take as many computer programming and writing classes as you can. These diverse skills will prepare you for an ever changing world of scientific research. Go to the best oceanography school you can afford and get accepted into.

Based on what you hear in the industry, what do you think are the most respected programs for oceanography that really make a difference to students who graduate from these schools?

Same as the "top companies" mentioned above.

JOB INFORMATION & ADVICE

What's the pay scale for someone just starting a career? How about for those at the senior level?

As an oceanographer with a Bachelor's degree, someone can expect to start out at ~$30,000 per year. If you have a PhD and are one of the best in your field, you may make over $130,000 per year.

What are some of the top companies and agencies to work for in the field of oceanography?

I really don't know, but I would like to say that Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory and Scripps Institution of Oceanography are among the world's best academic institutions and that NOAA is probably the top government entity in oceanographic research.

What advice can you give regarding the best ways to find a job in the field? How does one get a foot-in-the-door?

Be persistent. Try to make personal contact with someone in the facility you are interested in working for. Work as a volunteer if you have to. Besides, you may find out, by being around a research facility, that a science career is not what you expected it to be.

How is the job market right now? How do you think it will be in the next five years? 10 years?

My agency is currently under a hiring freeze, so things are a bit tight right now. That's why having a strong educational background is more crucial than ever. The future of scientific research depends greatly on the attitude toward scientific research of the person or party in the White House.

INDUSTRY TRENDS

What are some trends and challenges that you see in the field that might help prospective students?

The trend toward scientists being able to write their own computer programs and do their own graphics and analysis is different from the way it was even 10 years ago.

The sheer volume of new information can be overwhelming. The competition for research grants is intense. Justifying and proving the relevance of one's research goals to the average tax payer, when you are trying to get funding, is always a tough challenge.

CLOSING REMARKS

Is there anything else you can tell us about yourself, your career, or the profession that would be interesting or helpful to others aspiring to enter the field of oceanography?

One of my strongest assets is that I am very determined and refuse to give up. Ever! I love my job. I would do scientific research even if I was a billionaire!

If you have any questions for Mr. Forde related to this interview, please refer to his web site where you may read more about his work: www.aoml.noaa.gov/od/people/forde/

EDITOR'S NOTE: For more information about the educational and career outlook for Oceanography majors, click here.

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